Justin Holbrook discussion

Funny how you never hear the Raiders say we really want to represent the white collar public servants of the capital. They’re too busy trying to be a good team.

They’re a football team, not a bunch of tradies. I want them to look like they represent a competent NRL Football club who plays a style of football that suits the players they have so they win games. That’s their job
I think it’s more because every former player who is ever interviewed or talks about the club references it. Being tough and gritty is also a good quality for a team to have. I doubt he really cares, but if he said “stuff playing tough blue-collar footy, I want this side to have the best game plan week in week out” then he probably has everyone offside from the jump.
 
Justin has his work cut out for him, good thing is his coming in and no one will expect anything from him so zero pressure next year.


Matty & Cronk analysis: “Another wooden spoon. I feel for the supporters and the community up there, because this year they just kept turning up and turning up, and the last six weeks really disappointing,” said Johns, a Knights great. “They had a bad run of injuries, they lost their attacking sparks in Kalyn Ponga, Fletcher Sharpe and Dylan Lucas. We haven’t spoken a lot about Dylan Lucas — he was huge for the Knights. I had Dylan Lucas as our best player.” Cronk added: “Dane Gagai for me was the most consistent player for the Knights. A bad year.”
 
Funny how you never hear the Raiders say we really want to represent the white collar public servants of the capital. They’re too busy trying to be a good team.

They’re a football team, not a bunch of tradies. I want them to look like they represent a competent NRL Football club who plays a style of football that suits the players they have so they win games. That’s their job
Yeah, I hear you. I don't think I've ever used the term blue collar town until you mentioned not wanting to hear it in the previous post. I guess that's trolling? But it did vome from a friendly place.

I do think the whole "be the player" ideal is important. We were built on hard nosed forward packs back in the day. I think that basis has shifted somewhat given the speed of the game today, tough is still good, but athleticism is paramount, so that idea is a bit outdated.
 
I do think the whole "be the player" ideal is important. We were built on hard nosed forward packs back in the day. I think that basis has shifted somewhat given the speed of the game today, tough is still good, but athleticism is paramount, so that idea is a bit outdated.
Completely agree with all this, I think the “be the player” motto is good and something they should aspire to.

Yasmine Clydesdale in the presser after her 50th was talking about this and it being what she strives for and if any player typifies this motto, it’s her.

The blue collar BS annoys me because it always feels so hollow. Just words used to appease the public. Meanwhile they go out and win 2 games at home all year.
 
Completely agree with all this, I think the “be the player” motto is good and something they should aspire to.

Yasmine Clydesdale in the presser after her 50th was talking about this and it being what she strives for and if any player typifies this motto, it’s her.

The blue collar BS annoys me because it always feels so hollow. Just words used to appease the public. Meanwhile they go out and win 2 games at home all year.
Cool, you'll never hear bct from me again, promise.
 
I still think with our squad (barring huge injuries) our upper limit is around 8. If we do that playing good looking footy instead of boring aob ball I’ll be happy next year
 
Completely agree with all this, I think the “be the player” motto is good and something they should aspire to.

Yasmine Clydesdale in the presser after her 50th was talking about this and it being what she strives for and if any player typifies this motto, it’s her.

The blue collar BS annoys me because it always feels so hollow. Just words used to appease the public. Meanwhile they go out and win 2 games at home all year.
Hear me out:

Blue collar - out.

White collar - in.

Specifically I mean: Put white collars back on the jerseys they look nice.

Bring back 2001.

Including: Scoring heaps and heaps of ****ing tries.
 
I wouldn't read too much in to the cliche stuff.

Of course that's what he will say, PR and all.

I am ignoring it all until we see some evidence of how he is going to change things through pre season and trials, plus first few home games.

They are a professional sporting organisation and should play a style that works for the teams squad and against our opposition. Not a style the town expects.

The town just expects wins.
It's better then bringing Darius Boyd everywhere with you and thinking he will solve all your problems, and repeatedly saying they have to buy in to the way I want them to play.
 
It’s integral he gets the right support staff our team lacks physicality we lose most contact collisions a kicking coach that will enable usto kick more then 30m a skills coach that can turn around the constant drop passes when it comes two 2 on 1 vs fullbacks
 
I would have respected Holbrook more if he came out and said that with so many with so many weapons to work with he want's us to be the slickest attacking side in the comp.
We honestly should be up there next year pending fitness. And reading between the lines of his comments he kind of does basically say that, given the only players he specifically mentions, in terms of talking to them and nutting out roles, are the spine players. I reckon he looks at us and sees a side with a lot of pieces in place besides that.

One big thing I think behind the big changes in the pecking order this season was spine upheaval in some traditional top sides & what are usually mid table sides getting their **** together way more. Aside from Melbourne always having the best spine in the game, always, because they're run by wizards, it's interesting looking at the rest of the ladder and noting what has changed this year & what will change next year:

Raiders - Figured out a great recipe for them, too bad they are removing the most important piece next year, womp womp. I guarantee they slide a long way down the ladder.
Storm - As mentioned above, will always have the best spine, will always be great, we will never be rid of them.
Bulldogs - Had a recipe which works and decided it would be a good idea to blow it all up when they were en route to a minor premiership, Gus gonna Gus. Galvin isn't a 7. Huge question marks next year IMO.
Broncos - Unexpected issues with Reynolds/Hunt as a halves combo, it might honestly be because they're too old and slow to play together at 6 and 7, with Walsh and Mam both fit they will be ****ing terrifying next year, especially with the level Walsh has reached now.
Sharks - Not the best spine, but they seem to think it's smart to have a good one and settle on it for some strange reason. Blayke Brailey is legit the 2nd best 9 in the game now though IMO.
Warriors - Smart coach, has worked out something which works very well for them, should be stable next year once Metcalf is back.
Panthers - Held Talagi back for a while because they didn't think he "got" the system yet, will be better for the run and they will be a favourite next year again. May very well win it again next year FFS.
Roosters - Squandered some early games on Chad Townsend who's totally cooked, Sandon Smith and Hugo Savala both did quite well given experience etc but obviously Sam Walker is in another class, Reece Robson & DCE in I think puts their spine on or around the top tier with Brisbane, those two vying for second best spine behind Melbourne.
Dolphins - If they can just get some injury luck in the forwards this is a top 6 side, spine has been great all year and looks even better with Fuller at 1 and Hamiso at centre.

Then below that there's a bunch of upheaval-ridden, uncertain clubs, except I think Parra will settle on Iongi-Papalii-Moses-Da Silva and that's the main reason they'll keep improving, and, cross fingers, maybe us. Legit think if we just settle on Crossland and Sandon, who are proven capable in a role, with an international class 6 and 1, there's still a clear gap between us and the very top sides, but it should at least be a top 8 calibre spine under a good coach, with scope for continued improvement.

IMO a plausible spine ranking next year is: 1. Melbourne, 2. Roosters, 3. Broncos, 4. Panthers, 5. Sharks, 6. Dolphins, and then us, NZ and Parramatta vying for 7th best. Some may call that optimistic but I think it's plausible, no one seems to be able to keep a quartet together longer than one season and if we can just get some fkn continuity and stability with four decent to great players, it will go a long way.

And then besides the spine, I don't think there are a lot of sides that have better weapons than Bradman, Lucas, Young, and wherever Sharpe ends up. It *should* be a good attacking side.
 
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1. Melbourne, 2. Roosters, 3. Broncos, 4. Panthers, 5. Sharks, 6. Dolphins, and then us, NZ and Parramatta vying for 7th best. Some may call that optimistic but I think it's plausible, no one seems to be able to keep a quartet together longer than one season and if we can just get some fkn continuity and stability with four decent to great players, it will go a long way.

I'd probably say spine 8th at best without a ball being kicked, but Sharpe/Gags/Best/Dom is a top 4 outside backs group. If you can't get something out of them you're not trying (ie. AOB)
 
Can they all **** off with this ****.

As a Novacastrian, I want their style to be winning.

If I never hear blue collar town again It will be too soon.
QFT
It’s the biggest wank ever. Especially when people from Sydney use it in a condescending way to make us all sound like dirt poor country bumpkins.
 
I'd probably say spine 8th at best without a ball being kicked, but Sharpe/Gags/Best/Dom is a top 4 outside backs group. If you can't get something out of them you're not trying (ie. AOB)
Yep I think that's very fair. A clear best 6 spines (side note: that Dolphins spine likely costs them only a bit over $2 million, cumulatively), and then it should be the case that we should be somewhere just after that if the coach knows what he's doing at all.

That's what's crazy about the NRL, it's the most important part of the team and no one seems to be able to get and keep a stable combination together... except the team which finishes in the top three almost every season. With Brown & Moses broken up, Tricky and Nicho are the longest tenured halves combo (since late 2023), next would be Isaiya Katoa and Kodi Nikorima, who play for a club that is only three years old lmao. And that's just halves.

Get a good period of continuity, and that correlates strongly with good regular seasons, and at least a chance at winning something, even for clubs that aren't thought of as being on that 'top' tier, and/or you're doing it without a ridiculous Melbourne-style quartet: Mahoney/Moses/Brown/Gutho; Cook/Reynolds/Walker; B Brailey/Nicho/Kennedy; Granville/Thurston/Morgan/Coote.

And in a comp full of clubs which can not get any spine continuity going at all, we have probably been the absolute worst for it.
 
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So Brett Kimmorley has quit his job as Wests NRLW coach.
No word on a future job.

So we have former Knights halfbacks Holbrook, Jefferies, Green, Dobson, Mullen all onboard, and I think Hagan is back in the fold after O'Brien didn't want him.

We obviously need Kimmorley as an assistant, and maybe Morris.
But who is the defence coach?
 
We honestly should be up there next year pending fitness. And reading between the lines of his comments he kind of does basically say that, given the only players he specifically mentions, in terms of talking to them and nutting out roles, are the spine players. I reckon he looks at us and sees a side with a lot of pieces in place besides that.

One big thing I think behind the big changes in the pecking order this season was spine upheaval in some traditional top sides & what are usually mid table sides getting their **** together way more. Aside from Melbourne always having the best spine in the game, always, because they're run by wizards, it's interesting looking at the rest of the ladder and noting what has changed this year & what will change next year:

Raiders - Figured out a great recipe for them, too bad they are removing the most important piece next year, womp womp. I guarantee they slide a long way down the ladder.
Storm - As mentioned above, will always have the best spine, will always be great, we will never be rid of them.
Bulldogs - Had a recipe which works and decided it would be a good idea to blow it all up when they were en route to a minor premiership, Gus gonna Gus. Galvin isn't a 7. Huge question marks next year IMO.
Broncos - Unexpected issues with Reynolds/Hunt as a halves combo, it might honestly be because they're too old and slow to play together at 6 and 7, with Walsh and Mam both fit they will be ****ing terrifying next year, especially with the level Walsh has reached now.
Sharks - Not the best spine, but they seem to think it's smart to have a good one and settle on it for some strange reason. Blayke Brailey is legit the 2nd best 9 in the game now though IMO.
Warriors - Smart coach, has worked out something which works very well for them, should be stable next year once Metcalf is back.
Panthers - Held Talagi back for a while because they didn't think he "got" the system yet, will be better for the run and they will be a favourite next year again. May very well win it again next year FFS.
Roosters - Squandered some early games on Chad Townsend who's totally cooked, Sandon Smith and Hugo Savala both did quite well given experience etc but obviously Sam Walker is in another class, Reece Robson & DCE in I think puts their spine on or around the top tier with Brisbane, those two vying for second best spine behind Melbourne.
Dolphins - If they can just get some injury luck in the forwards this is a top 6 side, spine has been great all year and looks even better with Fuller at 1 and Hamiso at centre.

Then below that there's a bunch of upheaval-ridden, uncertain clubs, except I think Parra will settle on Iongi-Papalii-Moses-Da Silva and that's the main reason they'll keep improving, and, cross fingers, maybe us. Legit think if we just settle on Crossland and Sandon, who are proven capable in a role, with an international class 6 and 1, there's still a clear gap between us and the very top sides, but it should at least be a top 8 calibre spine under a good coach, with scope for continued improvement.

IMO a plausible spine ranking next year is: 1. Melbourne, 2. Roosters, 3. Broncos, 4. Panthers, 5. Sharks, 6. Dolphins, and then us, NZ and Parramatta vying for 7th best. Some may call that optimistic but I think it's plausible, no one seems to be able to keep a quartet together longer than one season and if we can just get some fkn continuity and stability with four decent to great players, it will go a long way.

And then besides the spine, I don't think there are a lot of sides that have better weapons than Bradman, Lucas, Young, and wherever Sharpe ends up. It *should* be a good attacking side.
And this is exactly why it annoys me so much when the media keep saying Newcastle is in trouble, they have huge problems, they require a massive rebuild and Holbrook has a huge job ahead of him

I’d say POS has rebuilt our roster in one season. On paper our team next year is very strong and we have some depth for the most part. Only issue is a few are young and unproven, so their performances may be inconsistent

I’d say we are definitely a top 7 to 10 team, in top 8 contention if all things go well
 
1. Ponga (Aus fullback)
6. Brown (NZ 5/8th)
7. Smith
9. Crossland (NZ Hooker)

Granted Ponga isnt the incumbent, but lets not pretend that if he didnt play for Newy under AOB he'd have a mortgage on that jersey.

I personally think Smith is a better half than Brown. Perhaps not as stylish and physically gifted, but Smith is a baller, he is highly energetic and versatile player maker. There's plenty of growth in that profile.

I personally hate Crossland at 9 and I don't think we can win a premiership (or even get close) with him touching the ball every play. But for the inception of this combination, if he can keep it very very simple and defend well it'll give the boys most of what they need to be at their best.
 
1. Ponga.
2. Marzhew.
3. Best.
4. Gagai.
5. Young.
6. Brown.
7. Sharpe.
8. Jacob.
9. Smith.
10. Mooney.
11. Mcewen.
12. Lucas.
13. Crossland.
14. Gamble.
15. Frizzell.
16. Psaulo.
17. Hopwood/Couch/Croker ect.

If we can keep the named players fit for long stretches we can be top 6 for mine.
 
1. Ponga (Aus fullback)
6. Brown (NZ 5/8th)
7. Smith
9. Crossland (NZ Hooker)

Granted Ponga isnt the incumbent, but lets not pretend that if he didnt play for Newy under AOB he'd have a mortgage on that jersey.

I personally think Smith is a better half than Brown. Perhaps not as stylish and physically gifted, but Smith is a baller, he is highly energetic and versatile player maker. There's plenty of growth in that profile.

I personally hate Crossland at 9 and I don't think we can win a premiership (or even get close) with him touching the ball every play. But for the inception of this combination, if he can keep it very very simple and defend well it'll give the boys most of what they need to be at their best.
We know Crossland is competent, can do the basics well, can perform a role in a great attack if he doesn't overplay his hand (in his defence, if the halves are playing better, he doesn't feel the need to overplay said hand).

We signed the 2024 NSW u19's hooker with I would have thought a clear progression plan in mind. Bringing Arthur along gradually with Phoenix as the steady hand who can transition to utility/14 when the kid is ready for the full time role. A sensible approach with a pretty proven track record - junior Origin/Aussie schoolboys players don't all pan out, but enough of them do that it has good odds as a long term bet. And I would have thought we've not seen anything from him this year to convince us it's a bad plan, but maybe I missed something.

Would love it if we could make a plan and stick with it.

Top of my wish list this off-season: Convince Ponga to defect to NZ. Best thing for the club and honestly I think it may very well be what's best for him too.
 
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