Dylan Brown discussion

Junior said:
i just think ya overthinking it all ngl, doesn’t matter what number or position he plays. Just matters what role he’s given and hopefully it’s to play dylbags natural game
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So far in his career it has mattered quite a bit, as has the amount of kicking he’s been asked to do. He’s consistently played better with vocal organising halves and/or halves partners who’ll shoulder more of the kicking load.
 
I’m still of the belief that the “halfback vs five-eighth” debate is a pretty outdated one, and is only as much of an issue as your gameplan allows it to be. Most of Brown's best moments today happened with him attacking a quick ruck from first receiver or second phase play rather than being set up by a mystical organising half. He had more touches than Foran as well. The disparity in forward packs is more of a valid argument.

I think it’s a pretty safe bet that long kicking won’t be a strong point next year regardless of how the deck chairs are shuffled but that doesn’t all have to fall on Brown’s shoulders, and I don’t think Smith playing halfback does much to change it either. He also hasn't proven to be a very good long kicker but there's nothing stopping him from kicking even if he’s playing hooker, be it from dummy half or first receiver especially with Crossland still out there in the middle. Crossland himself has a decent boot on him and could contribute from 9 or 13. Ponga can kick. Sharpe looked to at least have a big boot on him in his few kicks last season. The reality is we're going to be "working with what we have" at best regardless of who's wearing what number.

If they signed a genuinely good half then sure, that would be ideal. So far Smith has shown himself to be closer to the Cogger/Hastings/Gamble tier than something beyond that despite how he's talked about on here. There is no perfect option and we're going to be among the favourites for the spoon for a reason that goes beyond our spine options. Trying to make it an all-out running assault with Brown on one side and Sharpe on the other, and Smith/Crossland/Mooney/Ponga doing the playmaking through the middle sounds as good to me as putting high expectations on Smith as our "main" half. If Holbrook also believes he's better off at hooker I can tell you he's not the only one from within the Roosters who felt that way, not to mention O'Sullivan who believed in it enough to hand him a 4-year deal with that idea in mind (and has a pretty good track record for knowing this stuff).
 
There’s no mysticism in noting that Foran was clearly the more vocal half in yardage, directing where he wanted sets to end, doing most of the kicking…

“Organising half” doesn’t = “always at first receiver”. And noting how much of Brown’s good play came off the back of overcalling off the back of a quick ruck, or second phase play etc, yes that’s exactly the point when it's noted how much more he suits 6. That’s a half playing with liberty to attack what he sees. In games where he’s had the 7 on his back, he’s carrying most of the organising and kicking load, etc, poof, a lot of that just disappears. He stops running it. He’s not as “awake” to opportunities. He’s thinking too much.

Also him at 6 Sandon at 7 doesn’t mean he wouldn’t in many senses be the dominant half. He’d probably touch the ball more in that situation, a big part of that being the dozen or so extra touches where he’s literally just getting it and taking someone on with his run, because good things happen off the back of that.

I want a player at 7 who’ll shoulder a lot of that load in working the team down the field so Brown and Ponga just get to think - attack attack attack.

Also even very good kickers who play 9 only do so much because they’re under a lot of fatigue playing there, can’t think of many instances of a 9 leading a team for kick metres. I don’t buy “Sandon can just kick from 9” as a satisfying answer to the very real question of what the kicking game looks like with Brown/Sharpe halves.

Would also add that if you’re of the view that the bigger issue we’ll have is a forward pack that gets dominated, I’m not sure about starting games with 82kg Sandon and 89kg Crossland defending in the middle…
 
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No idea how people can watch Brown's last 3 games and think, yea he's suited to the role Foran played. And not understand that Brown's game is so narrow in its profile if he tried to play Forans role, not only would he probably suck at it, he'd not get the opportunity to do what he has done the past 3 games for NZ.

He is like Ponga. He is fit for a specific purpose. Ponga is wasted at 6/7. Let Dylbro sit on the right, stroll around casually off the ball and wait for the ball to arrive to him under half decent circumstances with options inside and outside and let him cook.

Leave the hard processing for Smith who clearly enjoys that stuff. He thinks fast and enjoys a domineering role. Brown hates constructing sets, so much so that he literally never even attempts to do it. He is not a first receiver. Yes, he does heaps of cheap fill-in work from hooker early in sets, but that doesnt count.
 
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mullenmagic said:
I’m still of the belief that the “halfback vs five-eighth” debate is a pretty outdated one, and is only as much of an issue as your gameplan allows it to be. Most of Brown's best moments today happened with him attacking a quick ruck from first receiver or second phase play rather than being set up by a mystical organising half. He had more touches than Foran as well. The disparity in forward packs is more of a valid argument.

I think it’s a pretty safe bet that long kicking won’t be a strong point next year regardless of how the deck chairs are shuffled but that doesn’t all have to fall on Brown’s shoulders, and I don’t think Smith playing halfback does much to change it either. He also hasn't proven to be a very good long kicker but there's nothing stopping him from kicking even if he’s playing hooker, be it from dummy half or first receiver especially with Crossland still out there in the middle. Crossland himself has a decent boot on him and could contribute from 9 or 13. Ponga can kick. Sharpe looked to at least have a big boot on him in his few kicks last season. The reality is we're going to be "working with what we have" at best regardless of who's wearing what number.

If they signed a genuinely good half then sure, that would be ideal. So far Smith has shown himself to be closer to the Cogger/Hastings/Gamble tier than something beyond that despite how he's talked about on here. There is no perfect option and we're going to be among the favourites for the spoon for a reason that goes beyond our spine options. Trying to make it an all-out running assault with Brown on one side and Sharpe on the other, and Smith/Crossland/Mooney/Ponga doing the playmaking through the middle sounds as good to me as putting high expectations on Smith as our "main" half. If Holbrook also believes he's better off at hooker I can tell you he's not the only one from within the Roosters who felt that way, not to mention O'Sullivan who believed in it enough to hand him a 4-year deal with that idea in mind (and has a pretty good track record for knowing this stuff).
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"So far, Smith has shown himself to be closer to the Cogger/Hastings/Gamble tier than something beyond that"

Watch this.

 
HarVeeGee13 said:
There’s no mysticism in noting that Foran was clearly the more vocal half in yardage, directing where he wanted sets to end, doing most of the kicking…

“Organising half” doesn’t = “always at first receiver”. And noting how much of Brown’s good play came off the back of overcalling off the back of a quick ruck, or second phase play etc, yes that’s exactly the point when it's noted how much more he suits 6. That’s a half playing with liberty to attack what he sees. In games where he’s had the 7 on his back, he’s carrying most of the organising and kicking load, etc, poof, a lot of that just disappears. He stops running it. He’s not as “awake” to opportunities. He’s thinking too much.

Also him at 6 Sandon at 7 doesn’t mean he wouldn’t in many senses be the dominant half. He’d probably touch the ball more in that situation, a big part of that being the dozen or so extra touches where he’s literally just getting it and taking someone on with his run, because good things happen off the back of that.

I want a player at 7 who’ll shoulder a lot of that load in working the team down the field so Brown and Ponga just get to think - attack attack attack.

Also even very good kickers who play 9 only do so much because they’re under a lot of fatigue playing there, can’t think of many instances of a 9 leading a team for kick metres. I don’t buy “Sandon can just kick from 9” as a satisfying answer to the very real question of what the kicking game looks like with Brown/Sharpe halves.

Would also add that if you’re of the view that the bigger issue we’ll have is a forward pack that gets dominated, I’m not sure about starting games with 82kg Sandon and 89kg Crossland defending in the middle…
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Watch, Sandon plays 7, Brown plays 6.

I am not buying 'Brown to 7' for a second. Its legit the most asinine idea. I'm kinda concerned that POS actually thinks it'd work. It plainly wouldn't work unless for the most perfect and rare of circumstances that would be nearly impossible to create. Maybe if Cam Smith was at hooker and you had a rep quality forward pack? But even then, Brown is wasted being that close to the ruck.
 
frankLauda said:
"So far, Smith has shown himself to be closer to the Cogger/Hastings/Gamble tier than something beyond that"

Watch this.

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Go and watch his last game for the Roosters where Savala plays 7 and Smith plays 6.

That'll show you what sort of 7 Smith will be for us. I think his profile is perfect for what we're trying to do. The only concern is the kicking
 
Les Misérables said:
Go and watch his last game for the Roosters where Savala plays 7 and Smith plays 6.

That'll show you what sort of 7 Smith will be for us. I think his profile is perfect for what we're trying to do. The only concern is the kicking
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I remember watching that game and how impressed I was with his game. Playing both sides for the ruck. The Roosters' signing DCE has done us a favour!
 
www.newcastleherald.com.au

Knights recruit 'can be world's best No.6' in Newcastle spotlight

Kieran Foran says Dylan Brown will have no issue dealing with the spotlight at Newcastle, while revealing his...
www.newcastleherald.com.au www.newcastleherald.com.au

Article where Foran says Brown can be the world's best 5/8.
He raves about Brown's Pacific cup effort and says he's "all but" tied up the golden boot.

Not a word from Foran about him as a 7.

Raves about his running game and elite 5/8 skills.
 
If you watch the kiwi press conference near the end, Stacey Jones -
“Dylan strength is his run game”
“we kept is simple for Dylan”.
“The main message from us for Dylan was not to over complicate it”

Dylan is a run first 5/8 and if he does that he’s proved he will be one of the best in the game. Knights, put a genuine 7 next to him and that’s Sandon Smith.
 
Grandpa Joe said:

Starting to get a man crush on ole mate.
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A baby boy due before start of the season..

Makes it twice as difficult for him to maintain form on the park when he isnt sleeping properly and his mrs is under the pump 24/7. I hope they have enough help at home otherwise it'll show in his footy. Probably the reason why his form dropped off after 22.
 
Grandpa Joe said:

Starting to get a man crush on ole mate.
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Said it from the moment we signed him, he’s just a quality person, and I hope he’ll add so much of that to the culture of the team. We need it!

Not many would have handled the season he’s had at Parramatta as professionally as he did, and then to come back and do what he did at the end of the year for the Kiwis was just the icing on the cake. Gives him a lot of momentum going into 26, which is great for us too.
 
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